Re: Is your operating system EOTW-Proof?

[freax]

*Censored*

[NCGunDude]

Dude, that's awsome! Obviously, a lot of time, effort, and thought has gone into your PC setup.

I'm not sure a PC is going to be needed if we're thrust into a 19th century agrarian society overnight. There's also the security aspect of being connected.

How about winlink 2000? I'm using Linux, and haven't done anything with it, however...

Since you didn't mention digital comms or winlink, thought I'd ask  ;)

73's

[gil]

I think Linux is best left to Server duties and not as a desktop OS, unless you need to do some really obscure thing with it.

I use Linux every day, for work and everything else. Since I switched from Window$ to Linux Mint on my laptop my productivity has gone up. That is because I don't spend any time waiting for my computer to reboot after a crash or install some huge updates every other day. All the programs I use (except for RMS express of course :( ) are available on Linux for free. That includes a whole MS Office suite clone that is compatible with the Microshit stuff (OpenOffice). I used to have trouble with my laptop freezing when trying to use SD cards or USB stick... Not anymore, everything works perfectly under Linux, including the laptop camera, everything! I still dual-boot because of the darn RMS-Express. If it wasn't for it, I would have ditched Windows entirely. Linux has come a long way on the desktop, it surpasses Windows now.

At home I use a Mac Mini, great machine. OSX is based on Unix, so very reliable. Linux is also a variant of Unix.

On servers, for work, I use FreeBSD mainly, but also work on Linux servers, often CentOS. I set-up servers with the Apache web server, DNS servers, mail, MySQL databases, etc. Anything running on a Unix server I can install and configure! Some machines I work on have not been rebooted in YEARS! Try that on Windows :o

So, yes, Linux is excellent on the desktop, to watch Youtube videos, edit Word or Excel documents, chat on Skype, record or play music, you name it, it can do it, is reliable and all softwares are free!

Gil.

[gil]

Would you recommend it to someone without any experience with computers whatsoever?

Today, yes. I would have said no ten years ago, maybe even five, but now I do suggest it and install it for newbies.

Gil.

[Lamewolf]

In an EOTW scenario, my operating system will be the least of my worries as there probably won't be any web service, power grid, people to connect with etc etc.  If I'm still alive, my main priority will be staying alive - eating, keeping warm or cool, hydrated, healthy.  In fact, I will feel very fortunate to have food, water, and shelter !

[cockpitbob]

I agree with LW.  I don't think many people will be sitting at a computer much, except possibly to watch security cameras around the perimiter. 

[gil]

Actually, no.

A computer would be the least of my concern in a TEOTWAWKI scenario. A solar powered pocket calculator would be the only computational tool I just might keep handy. Survival takes a whole lot of time, none for messing around with computers. Sure, I might store one for use years later, maybe... If I live that long. In all practicality, I think it would be outerly useless, and just one other item to lug around and need to produce power for.

Computers are a new invention, and personal computers have existed only for about thirty years. Everyone was doing just fine without them before that, including businesses and large organizations. I'm not saying they haven't changed the world, but when one has to worry about food, shelter and safety, no way anyone would even care about maintaining, using and transporting them. Their level of complexity makes them a liability. There would be no way to fix them or produce new components for decades. What if the only one or two computers used to run any kind of organization broke down? No way to retrieve the vital data or get a replacement. Computers are fragile, not adapted to such a new situation.

I would rather store paper, blank books and ink, pens and pencils. They don't need power and they don't break down. A good medical book would be worth it's weight in gold... And I am not referring to a pdf file.

No offense, but I don't think anyone is going to flash new firmware to FLIR cameras when finding clean water would be of utmost importance.

I believe that survivial requires a minimalistic approach to succeed. Radio itself, while important, is low on the list of priorities in a post apocalyptic situation. The only technology I would have is handhelds, a couple HF radios, a soldering iron and a pocket calculator. Stuff I can carry if needed, repair if necessary, and that doesn't require me to lug around a 100lbs battery. Anyone having to walk a few miles with a laptop in their backpack will throw it out on the side of the road on the first day and carry a bottle of water instead.

The only hard drive one needs to fill with useful data is one's own head. If it breaks down you have nothing to worry about.

Gil.

[Lamewolf]

Actually, no.

A computer would be the least of my concern in a TEOTWAWKI scenario. A solar powered pocket calculator would be the only computational tool I just might keep handy. Survival takes a whole lot of time, none for messing around with computers. Sure, I might store one for use years later, maybe... If I live that long. In all practicality, I think it would be outerly useless, and just one other item to lug around and need to produce power for.

Computers are a new invention, and personal computers have existed only for about thirty years. Everyone was doing just fine without them before that, including businesses and large organizations. I'm not saying they haven't changed the world, but when one has to worry about food, shelter and safety, no way anyone would even care about maintaining, using and transporting them. Their level of complexity makes them a liability. There would be no way to fix them or produce new components for decades. What if the only one or two computers used to run any kind of organization broke down? No way to retrieve the vital data or get a replacement. Computers are fragile, not adapted to such a new situation.

I would rather store paper, blank books and ink, pens and pencils. They don't need power and they don't break down. A good medical book would be worth it's weight in gold... And I am not referring to a pdf file.

No offense, but I don't think anyone is going to flash new firmware to FLIR cameras when finding clean water would be of utmost importance.

I believe that survivial requires a minimalistic approach to succeed. Radio itself, while important, is low on the list of priorities in a post apocalyptic situation. The only technology I would have is handhelds, a couple HF radios, a soldering iron and a pocket calculator. Stuff I can carry if needed, repair if necessary, and that doesn't require me to lug around a 100lbs battery. Anyone having to walk a few miles with a laptop in their backpack will throw it out on the side of the road on the first day and carry a bottle of water instead.

The only hard drive one needs to fill with useful data is one's own head. If it breaks down you have nothing to worry about.

Gil.

I agree Gil, I can see these computer guys either starving to death or dying of dehydration because they want to stay with their computer where there probably won't be any power to run it with or internet to connect it to.  Give me a good gun, a knife and other essential gear, I won't be dragging no stinking computer to the boonies with me !

[gil]

I agree Gil, I can see these computer guys either starving to death or dying of dehydration because they want to stay with their computer where there probably won't be any power to run it with or internet to connect it to.  Give me a good gun, a knife and other essential gear, I won't be dragging no stinking computer to the boonies with me !

Absolutely! I am a programmer by trade, but my computers will be the first thing to take the boot ;D

Gil.

[Lamewolf]

Actually, no.

A computer would be the least of my concern in a TEOTWAWKI scenario. A solar powered pocket calculator would be the only computational tool I just might keep handy. Survival takes a whole lot of time, none for messing around with computers. Sure, I might store one for use years later, maybe... If I live that long. In all practicality, I think it would be outerly useless, and just one other item to lug around and need to produce power for.

Computers are a new invention, and personal computers have existed only for about thirty years. Everyone was doing just fine without them before that, including businesses and large organizations. I'm not saying they haven't changed the world, but when one has to worry about food, shelter and safety, no way anyone would even care about maintaining, using and transporting them. Their level of complexity makes them a liability. There would be no way to fix them or produce new components for decades. What if the only one or two computers used to run any kind of organization broke down? No way to retrieve the vital data or get a replacement. Computers are fragile, not adapted to such a new situation.

I would rather store paper, blank books and ink, pens and pencils. They don't need power and they don't break down. A good medical book would be worth it's weight in gold... And I am not referring to a pdf file.

No offense, but I don't think anyone is going to flash new firmware to FLIR cameras when finding clean water would be of utmost importance.

I believe that survivial requires a minimalistic approach to succeed. Radio itself, while important, is low on the list of priorities in a post apocalyptic situation. The only technology I would have is handhelds, a couple HF radios, a soldering iron and a pocket calculator. Stuff I can carry if needed, repair if necessary, and that doesn't require me to lug around a 100lbs battery. Anyone having to walk a few miles with a laptop in their backpack will throw it out on the side of the road on the first day and carry a bottle of water instead.

The only hard drive one needs to fill with useful data is one's own head. If it breaks down you have nothing to worry about.

Gil.

I agree Gil, I can see these computer guys either starving to death or dying of dehydration because they want to stay with their computer where there probably won't be any power to run it with or internet to connect it to.  Give me a good gun, a knife and other essential gear, I won't be dragging no stinking computer to the boonies with me !

computer guys have plenty of money and my 400 amp hour 400 watt solar panel system could fit onto the back of a trailer though I might downsize it a bit to 200 amp hour just to prevent the axle from snapping. Thats the plan anyway, put it on a trailer.

What happens when the other dooms dayers steals your solar panels ?  Do you really think all that money is going to do any good when money no longer has any value ?  Better use at least some of it to invest in something that offers a bit of protection and stockpiles of non perishable food and a place to hide it ! ::)

[gil]

Freax, not many people plan beyond immediate survival, a few years at most I would imagine. It's great that you do, but here is where I think the problem lies: All that technology would be a hindrance in the first 2-3 years, and then a liability for the next 10 or 20, at least until spare parts can be manufactured.

Now that you mention the EeePC however, I can imagine that something that small could be used to carry reference books. So in that case, you're right. If anything happened to it though, you'd lose all your data.

The best plan in my opinion would be to store computers in a big plastic waterproof case and bury them until the time comes when it would be safe and useful to dig them out. I would place valuable books in the same case, except for one or two about medicine, as I mentioned. I would not carry more than one or two books.

The only technology I would have with me would be a solar powered pocket calculator, small multimeter, handheld radios (VHF/UHF) a couple QRP CW rigs, a SW receiver, a flashlight and a headlight, all powered by AA batteries recharged by a portable solar panel (I have a Nomad-7). But even that would not last, as the batteries would slowly get bad. Better know how to make batteries using metal plates and acid. The small multimeter would be used to verify voltage. BTW ink and paper are easier to make than a CPU, or even a simple diode.

I know computers very well. I went to school for electronics, then started programming when I was 14, in the 80s. I know operating systems in and out, work on Unix every day. Yet I know that when the SHTF, I won't need a computer, don't want one. They are not needed to have a good life. Younger people are so stuck on technology, they can't imagine living without it. I can. It's really no big deal.

I will also mention that assuming that you will have a running car with fresh gas to lug around your electronics and batteries on open and well maintained roads is extremely unlikely; not for long anyway. Better plan on worst case scenario, which is being on foot, with a bad leg. Anything not vital then will be thrown out, computer and batteries first.

When I was a kid there was no computers. People lived very well. My grandfather went hunting without a GPS, my grandmother made wonderful preserve without consulting a PDA. My father ran an insurance business without a computer. We wrote letters on paper with a fountain pen. I had a CB radio! That was the highest technology in the house. Hell, I even remember B&W tube televisions, and I'm only 48. Computers, what's that? I got one of the first ZX-81s that came out, with one kilobyte of RAM! My parents were smart enough to see that it was something I probably should get into at a young age. Anyway, anyone who's on the downhill side of 45 very well knows that computers are far from a necessity.

Gil.

[NavySEAL]

Paper would be in short supply? I don't think so..........dis-regard all the paper that will still be left in building etc...........didn't most of you younguns' learn how to make paper in grade school? I did.

[BlinkyBill]

I would assume that in reality EOTW will more likely end up being End of a Region.  There will more than likely be plenty of other parts of the world that will continue to function effectively.  The key then would be to be able to communicate with them for that info that you no longer have access to on a computer, which is where HF radio will come into play.

I would also have thought, that because our modern society is built on the division of labour, communities would form where different bodies of knowledge would be available, rather than every man needing to know all for himself.

[gil]

Paper would be in short supply? I don't think so.....

Yes, I would be more concerned about toilet paper myself :o

The key then would be to be able to communicate with them for that info that you no longer have access to on a computer, which is where HF radio will come into play.

Absolutely. And digital modes, while being great, would soon give way to a return to both voice and Morse, being easier and less dependent modes. The only exception would be low power rigs with built-in PSK31 for instance, where a computer would not be required. The KX3 is the only rig I can think of that offers that option, but it is a complex radio. I sold mine because I used only maybe 10% of its capabilities, and it is a big chunk of money sitting on my desk. Now I went back to the K1 as my main radio. I might get a MFJ-9420X for the rare times I want to use USB, on 14300 mostly, though my Icom IC-M700 does that, but at a high current price. I will not bother with digital modes anymore. Well, except CW of course, but the decoder is in my head ;)

Gil.

[gil]

Again, I am not saying computers wouldn't be needed eventually. They would. But not for a long time, during which lugging one and the means to power it would be a liability. Hence my suggestion to bury it for later retrieval.

Gil.