Thanks Bob,

A little more info...  I was using a mobile radio in the car at 50W, into a high gain vertical.  A more efficient antenna would offer limited benefits as it's the surrounding terrain that was the limiting factor, not the signal strength.

The reason I was considering a cross band repeat handheld is to negate the issues of cable transmission loss.  For minimal dollars, it could be a fun experimentation platform.  I could try a tree but was hoping for more elevation that what that could offer.

A couple of months ago my son and I sent a kite up with about 200m of line.  Naturally it wasn't vertical elevation, but was certainly high!  I would need a bigger kite if it needed to support a radio though.

I was camping over the weekend, and could just receive a repeater, but couldn't get in.  Certainly no simplex on vhf.  Very hilly area.  I'm confident that given an extra 50 to 100m of elevation I would have been fine.

Turning my thoughts to the cheep HTs that offer cross band repeat, was wondering what options there may be to loft one of them up in the air.

A kite or tethered balloon are immediate thoughts, one for windy conditions, the other for calm.

Can anyone suggest alternate sky hook platforms?

Honestly Freax, you need to spend less time on the Internet, and more time interacting with real happy people who will challenge your negative view by the life they live, rather than just re-enforce it, which is what selective reading on the Internet does.  Your view of reality is so skewed, with so many errors of fact in many of your posts, it's rather sad. 

I really feel for you man, and would like to help,, even if it's just as someone you can talk to.  Send me a PM with your phone number if you like.  I'll be happy to call you, and we can chew the fat.

Gil, my take on it is that radio is no longer enough as a hobby for its own sake as far as the traditional technically bent in the population are concerned.  Technology has well surpassed ham radio for day to day lives, and the technological frontier is not ham radio anymore.

These days we need to show how ham radio can support other activities and interests.  Prepping is one classic example.  We also see a fair uptake in model rocketry for telemetry using digital etc.  4x4 clubs and motorbike touring groups currently benefit too.

So the bigger question I see is, what other hobbies and interests is radio a good fit for, and how can we show them the value that radio would offer them?

Let's also accept that ham radio is very expensive compared to most other technology related pursuits, which sadly does play a part.

Freax, that was a great response.  The distinction between our two points of view was exceptionally well articulated, and I do agree that if I experienced the world through your world view, I would be unprepared.

Cockpitbob, great read.  I'd be interested in knowing what a difference having another person in there with you would have made. 

In my part of the world it doesn't get that cold, but with wind chill a couple of people die most years in the mountains.  Snow caves here get you out of the wind, where it's rather cosy, but haven't done it on my own.  Your temps are crazy though!

A question related to freax's comment re sheep skin.  My thought would be sheep skin wouldn't be great as when it gets wet it will take a lot to dry.  But that's in temps nowhere near zero F.  When it's that cold can you just let the moisture freeze and bang the ice off, such that it's it's not an issue?  I know a silk sleeping bag liner makes a huge difference, and holds very little moisture, but have no experience at your type of temps.

Freax, to be clear, I have no interest in prepping for survival AGAINST others.  I guess I just have a lot more faith in humanity, with local recent history supporting my stance.  I hear what you're saying, I just don't agree about your tinderbox view.  My prepping is related to surviving natural disaster type events, where the timespan is perhaps up to say 24 months or so (how long for most houses to be rebuilt after a disaster).

As to how I'll survive, being in Tasmania there are two scenarios that cause me concern.  The bass strait shipping route closing cutting us off from Australia, and natural disasters/events.  In these scenarios my main requirements for my family is food, water and shelter.

Where I live there is an abundance of fresh water in the form of creeks and rivers.  Many of which have never run dry in living memory.  I have enough faith in the authorities that should the town water supplies fail, they're not going to stop people collecting water from the rivers.  Additionally many homes have large water tanks which in the last 20 years or so have only needed replenishing from a truck a couple of times.  In fact town planning in many areas require new dwellings to have a water tank installed.  So I'm comfortable that I'm prepared as far as water goes.

Regarding food, as a state we produce surplus food, which is exported, so if we do get cut off, there's plenty to sustain us locally.  Our property has lovely soil, and we have many fruit trees.  Our veggie patch is only small, it could be easily ramped up.  Yes we do have seed in storage.  Most of our neighbors grow fruit and veggies too, and we along with them have chickens for eggs.  We as neighbors regularly pass on surplus home grown produce to each other, and pass on seed from plants that do well.

As far as shelter goes, we bush camp for about five weeks at a stretch every year for holidays.  We're confident that we would be comfortable with our camping set up.  The fact that it's on wheels makes it easy to take with us.  If the issue is localized, we have good friends on opposite ends of the state who who'll have no issues sharing their house with us for as long as it takes.  We built our house with super insulation and double glazing, so it stays warm, plus we have a wood heater with about three years of wood pre cut.  I also have a chainsaw if we need more, or to cut some for neighbors etc.

So that's how I prep for my identified risks.  I have a strategy which is supported by the lifestyle we already live.

And to bring it full circle to this forum, my CB and ham gear can be run from our camping set up via deep cycle battery and 200w solar panel forever. :)

No way could I live in a place where I expected society to go all Mad Max in the event of a collapse of whatever sort.

There have been plenty of instances where through natural disaster or war the regular constructs of society have collapsed, and the community, both rural and city have rallied to overcome the odds and rebuild.

Perhaps it's time to consider moving if you're worried about your fellow countrymen to that extent.

Wow Freax, you've put a fair bit of thought into this.  I'd like to offer an alternative view on the need to store information.  I may ramble a bit, so be it. 

Because this is all a moot point if only one part of the world is effected (look how fast Europe rebuilt after WW1/2), let's assume the entire planet is hit by massive solar flares that wipe out all transistor based electronics (even those deep underground by some strange unknown natural occurrence).  This event also causes an outbreak of fish-moths, which go on to eat all the books in the world  :'( .

Let me start by stating my position with regards to technology and quality of life.  With the exception of medicine and some engineering, I reckon that technology has made life more convenient, but not actually made our lives better/happier/more content.  With that in mind, I don't see the need to get back to our current technological level in a hurry to lead happy lives for me and my fellow man.  Rather focus efforts on rebuilding medical capacity etc.

Now with regards to replicating Wikipedia etc. what we need to remember is that it's just data or information.  It certainly isn't knowledge.  So where then does knowledge lie?  In the heads of people that currently use it.  While engineers/doctors/surgeons/law enforcement etc. use references frequently (digital or hard copy), I would imagine that they could function well with what knowledge they have in their brains.  Perhaps slower to start with, but they, like everyone else will start documenting and making notes (on slate or cloth probably, 'cos the fish-moths ate all the paper remember  ;) ) almost immediately so will improve their efficiency fairly quickly.  Certainly not to current levels, but hey, that's ok.

These people would in turn take on apprentices and pass on the knowledge, just like in the past that served humanity so well for so long.  Sure we'd loose democratizing of opportunity.  If you're an unpleasant person, in the wrong village, or someone else is smarter you'll miss out on the opportunity to train under a "master", but hey, at this stage the collective good is more important than your dreams and aspirations so we'll just suck it up.

And so life will go. Less convenient, but no worse off.

Then again, perhaps I'm just an optimist :)

I would assume that in reality EOTW will more likely end up being End of a Region.  There will more than likely be plenty of other parts of the world that will continue to function effectively.  The key then would be to be able to communicate with them for that info that you no longer have access to on a computer, which is where HF radio will come into play.

I would also have thought, that because our modern society is built on the division of labour, communities would form where different bodies of knowledge would be available, rather than every man needing to know all for himself.

Cockpitbob, I didn't need morse for my license, but am in the process of learning at the moment.  I plan that to be in a position to make CW contacts when I get my HF rig.

re the FT-857D, I'm looking at it for the reasons you state.  Keen to get into SOTA too, and while not the perfect rig its versatility win me over.  My only reluctance comes from paying for 15 year old technology.  If only they would update with IF filtering.

RadioRay...  :o

Hi All,

I've been lurking for several months, so thought it time to register an introduce myself.

I've been licensed for two years with the equivalent to your General license.  I live at the bottom of the world, in Hobart, Australia.

My interest in prepping is primarily related to the aftermath of natural disasters.  Fire, floods and wind cause problems here from time to time.  I live in paradise, geographically, socially and politically, so have no concerns about doom brought on by zombies, citizen uprisings or EMP's etc.  The primary attraction of this forum however is that people talk about getting out and using their gear, rather than discussion being limited to abstract or academic principles of amateur radio.

I am fairly active on 2m and 70cm, and am hoping to pick up my first HF radio in the next several months, probably an FT-857D.

Anyway, thanks for having me.