Radio Preppers

General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: cockpitbob on March 13, 2016, 08:00:59 PM

Title: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on March 13, 2016, 08:00:59 PM
I do very little public service, but what I have done has given me some knowledge and insight that is useful to a prepper.

As a ham volunteer I've provided comms services for the Boston Marathon the last 2 years.  Yup, I started the year after the Marathon bombings.  Today I went to a 4hr training seminar for medical personnel and hams working along the course; as opposed to Start area, Finish area or Transportation (shuttle busses). 

The Boston Marathon is a straight line 26.2 mile course spanning 7 towns.  The logistics for 30,000 runners and several thousand volunteers is staggering.  During my training and volunteering I've learned some things I thought I would share since they relate to prepping on one level or another.

Infrastructure for Disasters:
Especially when they talk about the lessons learned from the 2013 Marathon bombings, I start to get a picture of what we have for police, military, medical and fire.  It is substantial, but woefully inadequate for any large scale disaster or violent event.  Just to support the Marathon they pull resources from pretty far away.  If anything bad happens that affects more than about 0.1% of the population, we will be largely on our own. 

Active Shooter Situations:
Today we got a 1hr presentation from a Srgt in Massachusetts's SWAT.  It was much better than I thought, and he never once said the words I hate so much:  "shelter in place".

Here are some of my key take-aways from his talk:
* Active shooter situations are over in 10-15 minutes.
* The shooters usually end it themselves within minutes of help showing up, or at the first real resistance they encounter.
* Time is your friend. Use/create a buffer zone, relocate, escape, or do anything to delay encountering the shooter.

Strategies changed after the Columbine shooting. When the killing started at Columbine, the cops on scene secured the perimeter and waited for SWAT (standard procedure back then). But, all killing was over in 16 minutes. SWAT showed up about 30 minutes after the killing started. The 2 boys killed themselves about 3 minutes after SWAT showed up. This is how the majority of active shooter situations play out.  The shooters usually aren't ready for a battle.  They've come to die.

After Columbine, the S.O.P. changed to whoever is there when it starts, they should engage right away. Don't wait for SWAT.  It will all be over by the time SWAT arrives.

One other take-away I got regard a bomb scenario (like the 2013 Marathon). When a bomb goes off, don't everyone rush in to help the victims. At most, the minimum medical crew needed to deal with the number of injured should go in.
* If the bad guy knows what he's doing, there will be a 2nd bomb to take out the first responders.
* If everyone is there helping and a 2nd bomb goes off, there's no one left to help them.
* If everyone goes in to help, you have a crowd of people standing around getting in the way and adding confusion. This is what happend 3 years ago.
* The first cops on scene are NOT going to help the wounded, no matter how much they are bleeding. Their job is to make the area safe (get the bad guy, find the other bomb, etc.)

He never addressed the possibility of us being armed, but he spent a lot of time putting responsibility for decisions and actions on us. A couple times he sort of implied that going on the attack was our decision. He explicitly stated that we are responsible for our safety, not the cops.

You never know what you're going to learn in ham radio :)
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: NCGunDude on March 14, 2016, 12:45:36 PM
One of the things we stress at our Ham Public Service events is we're not there to enforce the law. Charity bike rides are one of the types of events we support, and there are other cars on the road in addition to ourselves and the riders. If we see unsafe or illegal actions taken by anyone, it's our responsibility to call 911 to report the incident.

Once the proper personnel have been notified, which is the primary responsibility of emcomms, whether it's medical, fire, law enforcement, or net control, then you can assess the situation and evaluate the appropriate action to take.

Very good information about the Boston Marathon. I usually participate in a handful of ham public service events each year, but none on that scale. It's an opportunity to provide a valuable service to the community and gain practical radio experience.

Was the event run under DHS and NIMS?
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: RichardSinFWTX on March 14, 2016, 12:51:43 PM
State laws and city ordinances will vary; but I'd say that in the lion's share of public service events you will not be permitted to be armed and there's no way in Hell you're going to be allowed to "go on the attack" as you put it.  How will the cops know who the active shooter is and who's the overzealous ham?
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on March 14, 2016, 01:25:27 PM
Quote from: RichardSinFWTX on March 14, 2016, 12:51:43 PM
State laws and city ordinances will vary; but I'd say that in the lion's share of public service events you will not be permitted to be armed and there's no way in Hell you're going to be allowed to "go on the attack" as you put it.  How will the cops know who the active shooter is and who's the overzealous ham?
The 2 times I've serves at the Boston Marathon were 2014 & 2015 (right after the bombing).  Both years, from wherever I stood, I could see multiple armed law enforcement or military people.  A ham with a bunch of gear is likely to be searched, so I wouldn't carry a gun.  But even if I did carry, I wouldn't consider drawing it unless my life were in immediate danger.  As you point out, there's no way to tell a good guy from bad.  Also, I doubt the military folk get the same "shoot/don't shoot" decision training the police get.
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on March 14, 2016, 01:26:44 PM
Quote from: NCGunDude on March 14, 2016, 12:45:36 PM
Was the event run under DHS and NIMS?
Nope.  The state of MA runs it.  MEMA (Mass Emergency Management Agency) is involved but I'm not sure who is at the top of the security pyramid. 
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: RichardSinFWTX on March 14, 2016, 10:07:22 PM
Quote from: cockpitbob on March 14, 2016, 01:25:27 PM
The 2 times I've serves at the Boston Marathon were 2014 & 2015 (right after the bombing).  Both years, from wherever I stood, I could see multiple armed law enforcement or military people.  A ham with a bunch of gear is likely to be searched, so I wouldn't carry a gun.  But even if I did carry, I wouldn't consider drawing it unless my life were in immediate danger.  As you point out, there's no way to tell a good guy from bad.  Also, I doubt the military folk get the same "shoot/don't shoot" decision training the police get.


These days with all the operations in Iraq, Afghanistan and such the military does do a fair amount of MOUT (Military Operations in Urban Terrain) training.  A lot of that does involve shoot/no-shoot scenarios.

I do see your point.  I'm not going to say if I've ever carried at an event.  I do carry extra first aid and trauma gear.  If push ever comes to shove I plan to disappear into the woodwork until the lead stops flying and the dust has settled.  After that I'll take off my ham hat and put on my combat lifesaver hat.  That's just me though.
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: gil on March 15, 2016, 07:39:18 AM
I have always been on the fence about public service. Certainly the presence of trained individuals at events is a plus, but in most cases cell phones would be quite enough, no need for handheld ham radios. Would you still participate if only cell phones were allowed? It's good to practice radio skills in case cell service is down, but I still think in many cases ham radio is not warranted. Then there is the village wanker with all the patches, orange vest and an attitude to match who would show up at a bicycle race with an AR-15 if they let him. If I haven't participated in any club events it is in part to avoid being associated with people like that.
Don't misunderstand me, I am a big supporter of gun rights and ham radio, but radio clubs scare me, sort of. I think they scare a lot of real emergency officials as well. I was member of a good one in Sarasota, but the public events I still avoided.
What pissed me off was having to pay for classes to provide a free service...
Basically, while there are people genuinely wanting to help, there are far too many with questionable motives. To those I always want to say that their pseudo-uniform looks ridiculous and that they aren't a cop or some secret service radio agent..
In a real emergency ham radio will make all the difference, no doubt. At a local mini marathon, not so much. Only practicing coordinated efforts justifies participation in my opinion. Many clubs need to shape up, weed out the wankers  and provide a real service instead of being a tolerated hindrance.

Anyway, I'm just ranting, must be in a weird mood today ;-)

Gil
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on March 15, 2016, 08:40:24 AM
Regarding cell phones, radios have a distinct advantage in that everyone hears you.  Phones are point to point.  They do use texting at the Boston Marathon as a back-up, but you need the phone number for everyone you need to communicate with.  The responsibility is on you to get the message to them, as opposed to with radios the responsibility is distributed among the people who should be monitoring the correct frequencies.

When the bombs went off in Boston in 2013 the cell towers immediately overloaded and no one could get through.  My wife and kids were at the Boston Museum of Science at the time, miles away from the bombs, but we couldn't get through.  However, the Marathon's communication backbone (radios) was unaffected.  Good thing too.  They had about 25,000 runners on the course that they were able to stop.  I can only imagine the chaos if the runners kept coming into Boston.  As it was, it was a big logistical challenge.  What do you do with 25,000 nearly naked athletes on a cold April day in Massachusetts?  They chill down and cramp up fast and were miles from their transportation.  Last year I learned that there are buildings designated as rally/evacuation points along the course that we bring the runners to if we have to stop the race.  Only the team leaders of the First Aid and Water Stations know the location of the one near them until the day of the race when they tell their team.

Gil, you're right about the "wankers".  Fortunately, around here most hams are just on the old side and a bit nerdy.  I see very few "radio-tactical" guys.  Hanging with the nerds is a little undignified, but I can learn a lot from them.

My reasons for serving the Marathon are a bit selfish.  It's social.  I get a cool front row seat and an insider's view of the action in a world class event.  I learn about radio communications from some of the very best.  AND, at the end of the day they open up the Red Sox's Fenway Park for an after-party for the volunteers 8)

Later this year there will be a Formula-1 race held in the streets near Boston.  I wonder if they need ham volunteers  ::)
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: RichardSinFWTX on March 15, 2016, 10:45:06 AM
They probably will.  We have NASCAR races a couple times a year at Texas Motor Speedway.  Mostly they're just weather spotters watching for storms coming in so the powers that be can decide whether to evacuate.

I work a few events; the Cowtown Marathon, the Walk to End Alzheimer's and the March of Dimes' Walk for Babies.  I also do storm-spotting for our Emergency Management group.  These events do provide good training in how formal nets operate and how to interact with our served agencies.  Another benefit, albeit self-serving, is that one of the hospitals we work with serves as a point of distribution in the event that there's some sort of epidemic.  Emergency communicators would be among some of the earliest recipients if they're assisting with operations.  There's also the whole helping out your community thing.
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: gil on March 15, 2016, 04:08:40 PM
Good points Bob..

Gil
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: Quietguy on March 15, 2016, 08:36:44 PM
Quote from: cockpitbob on March 15, 2016, 08:40:24 AMFortunately, around here most hams are just on the old side and a bit nerdy.  I see very few "radio-tactical" guys.

Same thing for me, Bob.  I haven't been nearly as involved the last couple of years because of some physical problems, but I spent several years as an active volunteer and most of the people problems were the kind you find in any part of civilized society.  The rewards were numerous, not the least of which was gaining familiarity with the local law enforcement structure.  Our organization is not a traditional ARES group, but operates as an auxiliary (ACS - Auxiliary Communications Service) to the county Sheriff's office and members are subject to a background check.  We work with uniformed folks and are authorized to use their equipment on their frequencies during activation.  That made a huge difference in my understanding of what was being heard over the radio.  An additional benefit is being covered by state insurance as a Registered Emergency Worker when activated with a mission number.

Prepper articles usually mention the importance of including a "police scanner" for finding out what is going on.  But few mention how difficult it is to understand the radio traffic if you are not familiar with the structure and operational aspects of your local agencies.  Even though most, if not all, agencies are moving from 10-codes to plain language there is still a lot of confusion if you are not familiar with local structure.  More than once I have been able to turn to a near-by uniform and ask "what does that mean" when some unfamiliar piece of traffic comes over the radio... and they were always happy to tell me.

People who want to find out more about their local area should check out the local emcomm scene.  Just because the club in some other city has a lot of jerks in it doesn't mean your local club is the same.  Maybe I'm just lucky, but our group is comprised of a bunch of good people who have the desire to help their community.  And in return they receive a lot of side benefits - not the least of which is that elusive "insider knowledge".

Wally
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: km4mcm on March 19, 2016, 11:22:46 PM
The plain talk is coming from the NIMS interoperability training. Stemming from 911 and some other incidents.  Now, that said if you're monitoring a plain speech agency and you start hearing more codes or signal(followed by alphanumeric identifier) and you're working an event, one of two things are happening. 1. Somebody has committed a I.D.10-T error(locked keys in a vehicle, damaged a vehicle or misplaced equipment. and they're trying not to let everyone know. Or 2. Something serious is kicking off and they're trying get key tactical personnel placed or enroute quietly.

About misplaced equipment, cops are famous for leaving ticket books, hats, gloves even portable radios on top of a car and drive off.

As far as an active shooter goes, ID rather be tried 12 than carried by 6. If, God forbid, you ever have to use deadly force on a person or persons upon arrival of police offer no resistance. Meaning don't try explaining anything off the bat. Hands up. if you haven't dropped the weapon yet and can do so with one hand drop your mag and drop the gun. Don't wait for them to tell them you just do it.

They will treat you like a offender initially, grin an bare it. They are trying to secure the scene.

Now if you're operating as a ham and crap kicks off, you communicated informational details would of the most importance.

So weight heavily and quickly the tools you have at you disposal and how can you be of greatest benefit to the situational awareness of responders.
In an event scenario the event HQ or CP would usually be the first Command and control with it moving closer to incident later depending area covered by the event.

Also in large events, don't assume no uniform means civilian/offender off the bat either. More times than not there will a large contengent of plain clothes officers in the crowd.

If you field comms kit has image transmission capabilities, keep that in mind if a situation transforms from active to hostage. Someone may have video or stills that could transmitted if cell towers or clogged and hand delivery is not ideal given environmental or tactical factors.

Sorry for the novel. I just felt i would add my two cents based on my experience.





Sent from my QMV7A using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on March 20, 2016, 12:52:11 PM
KM4MCM, nice post.  Thanks for the insights.
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: RadioRay on March 21, 2016, 09:15:06 PM
Public service - yes, for many reasons. 

However,  this sort of thing gives me gas...
(http://i.imgur.com/xyZPw8v.jpg)
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: gil on March 22, 2016, 05:59:58 AM
http://www.hamsexy.com/cms/
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on March 22, 2016, 08:10:13 AM
Quote from: gil on March 22, 2016, 05:59:58 AM
http://www.hamsexy.com/cms/

Now that just sounds creepy, kind of like Ray's ARES guy.  I actually had the courage to click and was surprised to see the premise is making fun of and breaking the stereotype of the old, fat, unwashed and arrogant ham.  Still seems just a bit creepy though.
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: gil on March 22, 2016, 03:39:52 PM
Best entertainment value: Go to images.google.com and search for hamsexy.
The badges are creepy..
Not making fun of public service, but it does attract weirdos.. Which must make the work of serious hams in emcom all the more difficult.

Gil

Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on March 22, 2016, 04:16:38 PM
T-shirt in the suggested search:

Privately
Owned
Repeater
Network
:o
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on April 07, 2016, 08:15:28 AM
I got my assignment for the Boston Marathon.  I'll be at a first aid station 1 mile down the course.  This should be easy duty.  To be in the Boston Marathon you have to run a qualifying marathon somewhere else, so the runners have some experience.  I doubt there's many medical issues after running just 1 mile.  The bad news is I have to be out of bed at 4:00am to make the pre-meeting at 5:30.  The good news is we'll probably close shop 4 hours earlier than the stations towards the end of the course.  That will give me time to go home, have a meal and take a nap before going to the volunteer's after-party at the Red Sox's Fenway Park  8)

It should be fun being this close to the start line.  This will be my 3rd year and all I've done is work the middle of the course.  I think next year I'll put in for a spot at the starting area, finish line or on a shuttle bus.  It's a big, big even with amazing logistics going on.  They have more than 8,000 volunteers making it happen.  This year they have about 300 hams and that's fewer than they wanted.
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: RichardSinFWTX on April 07, 2016, 08:47:17 AM
Have fun with that!  I worked a water stop at the Fort Worth Cowtown Marathon this year, mile 22.  I was there from 6:00 AM til a little after 2:00.  All I wanted to do afterwards was go home and take a nap.

I'm working the March of Dimes Walk for Babies next weekend.
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on April 07, 2016, 05:37:39 PM
This reminds me.  I need to finish a little project.  My hearing sucks in the higher frequencies.  Most of the time it's OK but there have been some radios or repeaters that sound like someone is in the shower, talking into a coffee can, way down the hall.  The conference room speaker-phones at the home office I web-conference with are like this.  For my desk web conference setup I made a little equalizer that kills the low frequencies and raises the high freqs.  It makes a big difference.  I started making a little 9V powered box I can put between my HT and ear buds.  I should finish that so there's no chance I'm straining to understand someone.
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on April 11, 2016, 03:00:48 PM
Normal background radiation being measured (http://boston.cbslocal.com/2016/04/11/boston-helicopter-low-flying-radiation-nuclear-security/) around Boston prior to Boston Marathon.

The 80 sq-mile area doesn't begin to cover the whole 26 mile long (linear) Marathon course, and no mention of doing it at the Marathon staging area 26 miles to the west where they will have about 35,000 people concentrated in a small area. 
It makes perfect sense.  If you want to detect someone with an imperfectly shielded dirty bomb, you need to know what the naturally occurring background radiation looks like.  Now I have 1 more interesting thing to look for while on duty; a helicopter with an instrumentation pod.

On a bizarre, humorous note, wouldn't it be something if a bunch of radiation therapy patients all decided to watch the Marathon as a group. Maybe our detectors can tell the type of radiation so it wouldn't trigger a massive response.
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on April 16, 2016, 06:30:47 PM
As usual, the Boston Marathon infrastructure is amazing.  I'm bringing 2 HTs, one for a backup, so I need to program both.  I only need to program in 3 frequencies:  Primary and back-up medical, and the transportation(tired runner's bus).  But we all program in everything in case we get re-assigned, or the SHTF and we have to change things.  There are 19 simplex frequencies (with tone squelchs) and 27 repeaters!!!  The Start and Finish areas are mostly simplex while the course (water and medical stations), transportation and "net intertie" are repeaters.  About 10 are backups, so that's 36 frequencies/repeaters in use for the day  :o

Today I drove to my assigned station and verified that I had my 2 HTs programmed correctly.  As usual, I found a few errors.  It was also good just to see the location.  There's no place to park.  We're going to have to carpool or walk 1/2mile with our gear :-[ .  The good part is there are 2 hams assigned to this tent and other ham has been working the same first aid tent with the same medical crew the last 6 years.  This should go like clockwork and I should learn a lot  :) .
Title: Re: Public Service
Post by: cockpitbob on April 19, 2016, 09:44:18 AM
Another Boston Marathon is in the bag. 


Up at 4:00am for the 6:00am briefing.  This is just for the medical staff and hams covering the middle of the course.
(http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o170/cockpitbob/IMG_20160418_062321682_HDR_zps2uymjzyq.jpg) (http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o170/cockpitbob/IMG_20160418_062321682_HDR_zps2uymjzyq.jpg)


There were 2 of us hams at Med Tent-6.   Our 2 main jobs are to call in the hourly reports of how many runners we had in the tent, how many they've treated and how many left by ambulance, plus call for transportation for runners that had to drop out.  We  had really bad problems with the repeater.  It was coming in S9++ but half the time it couldn't hear us or we would break-up in the middle of the transmission.  It acted like someone had a stuck mic into the repeater, but you usually hear audio from the mic and there wasn't any. It was weird. Later we realized one of us should have pulled our car up to the tent and used the car's rig with 50W.  The stuck mic stuff stopped after a few hours making me think the guy who's mic kept sticking ran out of battery.

Regarding the buses, it was really bad.  We'd request a bus, then after half an hour call to ask for status on the bus and be told "well get back to you" but they never would.  They have special buses for "elite" runners (world class runners, often from other countries).  We had an elite runner at our station and it took over 1.5hrs to get her a bus.  Every 20 minutes or so we would call for status on the bus and they would ask for the runner's bib number and other information like it was the first they've heard of it.  At one point the other ham got hot under the collar and chewed them out (justified IMHO).  At one point I got out my backup radio (cheap UV-5R which works great) and monitored the transportation net.  Things weren't going smoothly or on schedule, and I heard no indications anyone was headed our way.  I was just getting ready to break protocol and call the transportation net directly (knowing I'd probably get spanked for it) when the bus arrived, almost 2hrs after I called for it.  In the whole event we only had 2 "tired runner" buses arrive (should have been about 5), and they were both well over an hour late.  The transportation infrastructure needs an overhaul.

Other than the bus stuff, it was a great day with great weather.


This always gets me.  Those are tongue depressors with gobs of Vaseline. The runners grab one and grease whatever is chaffing.  There is no modesty after 13 miles of a marathon. ::)
(http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o170/cockpitbob/IMG_20160418_111059680_zpsnawtwcjr.jpg) (http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o170/cockpitbob/IMG_20160418_111059680_zpsnawtwcjr.jpg)